0:02
As a business owner, building awareness of what you do and how you do it is key to the growth and profitability of your business. So I wanted to bring you a guest who has an exorbitant level of experience when it comes to building authority and brand awareness and using free PR to do it. Liz Nable is my guest on the podcast today. And she is also a featured guest inside the Regional Business Women's membership this month. And she's here to share her story which is fascinating. And also some of her knowledge of how she took her business from an unknown brand to a household name, and leveraged incredible growth. My guest today is Liz naval, a PR and media master. She's also a brand story specialist and author, speaker and a local area marketing expert. She's got a ton of media skills. But she started what we're going to learn today she's going to share her story around how she went from having no formal fitness or business training, but took the leap to join a franchise system, which within six months became Australia's first franchisee of this, what is now known as a well known brand in Australia. But at the time when she first started, we knew nothing about it in Australia. And I'm excited that Liz is joining us today to share that story, but also so much more around how she has really leveraged her experience in media, which was kind of like a life before her business which she'll share and has really transformed not only her own business journey, but also so many other small businesses along the way as well. So, welcome to the show. Liz, excited to have you here.
1:46
Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here. Yeah,
1:49
um, I kind of feel like I muddled through your bio there. But when I read in your bio, the journey that you've had into entrepreneurship and business and as in your words happen by accident, I would love for you to share with our listeners and with me more about your story and how it came to be that you now have this whole other business in the way that you teach and help people to leverage free PR, but that your original start into business was by accident, I could tell what is that?
2:21
It's very, very random. So I started out. I wanted to be a sports journalist at school and I didn't really know anything about sports journalism, I disliked the sound of the course name. So I had zero on that. So luckily I enjoyed it. So I ended up doing a sports journalism degree at Cameron University and then went into I didn't actually go into be a sports journalist, I just went in as a general news journalist, worked in regional Australia worked in Wagga in the Riverina region of New South Wales and got my first job as a regional reporter for channel seven or called was called prime. So I worked as a journalist, I ended up coming back to Sydney after two years working in a 24/7 news business, which was Sky News, which was one of the first of its kind at the time. And then work there for a few years worked on The Today Show worked at Channel 10, you know, most of the major networks, I worked as a producer and reporter and then my husband got a job overseas in the States. So I went with him and easiest way for me to work was under what's called an E visa, which was really easy visa to get which meant you could do a whole bunch of journalism and reporting work for overseas media outlets in the US. So I did that for six years. And then while we were over there, we did talk a little bit like we'd sort of talked kind of pie in the sky ideas you know about you know, founding this entrepreneurial flame that my husband and I both had to own our business and we talked about coffee shops and we talked about a few things and when I think about trying to do a food and beverage business now I'm you know, hats off to anyone who has a Oh yeah. So but then I saw I had I had my first child in the US and I tried this a few months after having the baby you know, you're trying to kind of get back into fitness and try and feel like you again and I tried so very well known now but totally unknown to me or the scene at the fitness center the time a bar workout and I tried it at this place called physique 57 And I couldn't get into a class it was Walter what was packed class I could get into was at like eight o'clock on a Friday night. And I tried this workout and I was like, you know leading up to that point I would say you know, I was relatively active kind of person but I never really loved going to the gym I found a chore. I found a boring I never really maintained any sort of routine because I didn't love it and I tried this workout and for the first time really ever in my adult life. I was like I love this like I can see why I can see how I you know I could do this four or five times a week and really enjoy it. You Um, and so I came home to my husband that night, and I was like, try this class, it's so amazing, you know, I reckon this would be a great business idea to take back home to Australia. And then that was it, we never really talked about it again. But I did continue doing the classes and, you know, got back into probably the best sort of fitness shape that I've ever been in, was really kind of super happy with the results. Long story short, we came back to Australia, and it was the tail end of the GFC, which we didn't, wasn't really call the GFC in the US. So on a whim, we came back to Australia, realize once we got here, that the market that the employment market was actually similar to how it is right now. It was very weak. My husband had come from working on Wall Street and a finance job, could not, you couldn't pay people to employ him like they just were not hiring, there was like one job that was at his level in the whole industry. I went back to work, we'd had another baby, we had a newborn. By this point, I went back to work working on a news desk. And by this point, you know, it was 12 hour shifts on a news desk because 24 hour news was a thing. I was like pumping breast milk in the toilets, like it was so unglamorous not getting paid a huge amount of money and sort of dawned on me after a few months that I was never going to be the chosen one in my career, as you know, now that I'd had children, and I wasn't available to kind of jump on a plane at a moment's notice and cover stories at three o'clock in the morning. And those sorts of things. I could see like, the vision of the future, and it was me working, you know, in at the same news desk for the same amount of money in you know, I could You could die there. And you know, and there were people who were there. I've had been there for two years. You know, my husband and I were like, What are we going to do? Like, we can't get the jobs that we thought we were so quality, which we were so qualified for the market wasn't there for those jobs. So we started to return to these ideas of what we could potentially do as our own business. And so we started to search into the boutique fitness market, particularly bar to see if there were any fitness brands coming from the US to Australia. Yeah, usually in fitness, it's about three to five years behind the trend in the US, Australia is. So we found this brand called extend bar. And they were trying to come to the Australian market, but they hadn't they hadn't landed here yet. And so long story short, we became their first franchisees of their brand here in Australia. And that's how it all started. So 18th of June 2012, which is 12 years ago, now we started our first business in on Sydney's lower north shore and and sort of grew the business from there. So that was my first it really was by accident, it kind of was just a serendipitous moment, a bunch of things going wrong and trying to take control of our future. And started our own business. Yeah, so Yeah, amazing.
7:50
So you started with one location, but then branched
7:54
out? Yeah, we started with one location. And so the story behind that is, when we first started, even though we were a franchise, there was no help here, there was no head office here, there was one girl who was flying back and forth from the US. But you know, I now know, in a franchise system, you're supposed to have like a whole support. We didn't have that. But we didn't know any different. So we also had no business experience whatsoever. So we hadn't didn't really have a marketing budget. So we would spend all our money on the feed out of the studio, and I got super excited about, you know, buying retail and when I should have been thinking about marketing. And so we used sort of by accident, because it was what I knew, we used my skills as a journalist to start to get featured in the media. And that was a free way for us to get exposure and build brand awareness because back then, there wasn't boutique fitness wasn't a thing. It was big. Jim's charging, you know, 20 bucks a week or whatever it might be. Yeah. So not only were we completely unknown as the name of the brand was completely unknown, like you said, bar back then and people thought you were opening like a pub or a bar. Yeah, that's how much brand awareness it was. There was zero brand awareness. Plus, we didn't have any money for marketing. Plus, there was no people weren't prepared to pay 35 bucks for a Pilates class back then there was massive pushback about the price. The massive shock to us because we would just didn't even think about that. Yeah. And then there was also the myths about the word extend bar. So a lot of people just automatically associated that with only for women a bit of a decorative workout with not much substance. Men can't do it. And you've got to be a dance, which was the polar opposite of what the Yeah, it was this incredible pilates workout that was, you know, so challenging. Got these amazing, you know, I lost 12 kilos in 10 weeks when I had tried it in the US. So I knew that it worked. Yeah, but we had all these myths that we had to dispel and no real way of doing it except for using the media as our mouthpiece. So I did because we didn't really have a choice. And so we ended up growing the business. We grew to four locations over eight years and, you know, building into this million dollar business, which was very exciting and, you know, wasn't easy navigated lots of challenges, but but one of the things I didn't know how to do was use the media to build that brand awareness and get that get the brand out there. So yeah, that's kind of how we grew. Incredible.
10:22
And so then you obviously came to a point in time where you decided you want to shift out of that business into what you're doing now as well. COVID did that? Yes, well, I can relate because having I had a dance studio, two locations during COVID, as well. And the pivot there was huge, because we may, and you guys would have been the same in the first band of businesses that had to close down because you're in the fitness industry, and you just had no choice. And so yeah,
10:49
yeah. So I had been doing for a mutual friend of ours, Mel Brown, she had asked me to come into some of her live workshops with her accounting clients, to teach them about the media and PR. So I had done a little bit of that, but I hadn't really thought about doing it as a business. And then in COVID, we obviously got shut down for long periods of time. And so I sort of looked to do turn his media and PR kind of consulting into an online business. And that's kind of how it started. So I was coming, having people coming to me one on one, us, it took me a long time to actually dawned on me that it was a legitimate business as
11:27
well. times I think your superpower like what we take for granted as what we do naturally, you're like, Oh, well, why can't other people just do that? And they look upon you going? How does she do that? I want to learn that? Yeah, it can be Yeah, I need to kind of like peel that back and go, Oh, maybe I am the business. I can. Yeah.
11:47
And even when I first started coaching people, I assumed a lot of knowledge and, and worked out, you know, after the first six months that I had to go back to basics with people and start to teach them the basics about how money works, you know, all those sorts of things. So yeah, and that's kind of how this business grew. So it was again, like out of necessity, started this business and realize there's quite a big market for servicing women in business, particularly in the small to medium sized business market. So a lot of my Well, most of my clients come to me because they don't have $10,000 a month to pay a PR company. Yeah. Nor do they need to, because they're not, you know, they're not Coca Cola. And they're not, you know, Optus, and that, but they want to get their name out there and start to get featured and use, you know, you know, they've got things to say in the media, they've got stories to tell, but they don't have that $10,000 A month budget. So, you know, I kind of realized over the first three to six months of doing their consulting work that it was actually, you know, a business.
12:45
So good. And so we know that there's lots of different ways to market a business. One of the ways is media coverage. Why do you believe that that's so good for business? And how do how is it that it delivers such great impact? Can you share a little bit about that? Yeah.
13:01
So there's lots of there's lots of answers to that question. We could probably be here for the next three hours. But I think particularly because we've COVID, and the more I've gone into this industry, and the more I've interviewed people, for my podcast, different specialists, and all this sort of stuff, I've realized that, you know, during COVID, everyone went online, so your dollars that say you'd normally spend $1,000 on a Facebook ad, and that would get you pretty good, you know, $1 per click, or whatever it might be, during COVID, like on mass, everyone was the only way people could communicate and get their name out there was generally through meta ads, Instagram, Facebook, those sorts of things. So that really diluted the return on a lot of people's investments. And now you probably realize you've got to pay more and more and more to get the same result. If not, yeah, looks good. As you did 10 years ago, when you could Chuck 50 bucks behind a, you know, a boosted post, yes. Now, we used to do that in our sale, and make like 25 grand a day. And now I mean, you wouldn't get one sale from that. So. So there was that. There's that not to say there's not a place obviously, there's a place for paid advertising in your business. So I teach in my course, you know, the three kind of pillars of marketing. So you've got your earned media, your paid media and your owned media owned media being your website, your email database, you know, blogs, a blog, if you have that on your website, anything that you wholly own as your own media channels, your paid media, obvious, you know, your meta ads, your Google ads, any sort of traditional paid advertising that you do, and then your earned media, which is what I teach, which is, you know, traditional media that you don't pay for So Sydney Morning Herald financial review news.com.au, those sorts of things. So the beauty of earned media is that the value of that media is I think, like there's there's very different research and survey, you know, statistics, somewhere between four to 10 times as valuable as paid advertising. Because of the credibility and trust that you get, as a part of being featured in a trusted media outlet, so if you know that the Australian Financial Review, you know, lists you in their top 40, under 40, you know, the readers trust that that and it is, you know, researched and, you know, the AFR build their business based on trust. That's why that's their business model is based on the trust that comes with being associated with their brand. So that when you're featured in that media outlet, by way of association, you become a trusted brand to Yes, so the credibility is key. And most of us will need some sort of credibility, to get people's trust for them to trust that we are the best 100 say have a good quality product, those sorts of things. It's one of the biggest value points, I think of getting media coverage earned media coverage.
15:52
Yeah, yeah. Couldn't agree more, I think to like, even though, you know, there's, there's value in marketing online, and, you know, doing your meta ads and stuff like that, too. But they've gone so quickly. Right, like, and whereas, yes, with the other media coverage, yeah, you might like, it also moves very fast. I know that the media moves fast. But those articles if they're an online article, still stay online, and SEO and all of that kind of stuff, too. Yeah, yeah. So
16:20
with with social media, again, there's definitely a place for that. And you know, that's an instant, you know, you can get instant return on investment. And you can see your stats and your analytics and all that stuff. But you don't own meta, Mark Zuckerberg owns meta, he gets to say what the algorithms are, who sees your ads, who sees your organic posts, you know, how much you pay when you pay, so that those platforms are, they're not owned by you. So yes, we can play that game to a certain extent, but they don't feed into SEO, you know, your stories are gone in 24 hours, those sorts of things. So earned media is, you know, sits on the internet and drives, you know, obviously, we're trying to use those keywords in any media that you're you're mentioned in or featured in, that feeds back to that SEO forever, as long as that media organization is in existence. And it helps build this organic reputation. Because, you know, that's the difference between paid media and earned media, you're building this organically, which takes a longer time, and people get frustrated with it, and they want this instant result. But you can work all three pillars in tandem, and you know, give each of them some time. And together, they work really well with media marketing mix. So
17:34
you mentioned your media marketing mix, which was the next question I was going to ask around, you may have already given us the rundown of what that is, in what you have already shared. Is there more to that? Or have we already covered that? Um, no, I
17:46
think the only thing I would add there is is you can use your earned media and, and leverage your earned media through those other two channels. So you get this feature in the Australian Financial Review, you can what I would advise very strongly that you take that earned media and you tell the world about it. So you put it in an EDM to your customer database, you talk about it on your blog, you if you have a podcast, or if you you know, you can mention it in those owned media channels, you can put the logos from the basis where you get featured on the bottom of your email signature, or as seen here on your website, on your media page or on your homepage, then you can also if you want to put money behind that media mentioned and create an ad with it. So not only do you get the organic, you know, results, and you get the, you know, the credibility and the trust we just talked about. But if you want to push that to more people, then you can turn that piece of media into paid advertising as well. So there's lots of different ways to leverage that coverage.
18:49
Yeah. And it's so clever. And I think that sometimes people don't think about it in that like Broadway, which is why I was like having you on the show here. But also having you inside the regional business, women's membership as a guest expert, this month is like going to be so valuable because every month we focus on something different this month, it's around branding and PR. And I know that you're just skimming the surface with our conversation here today. So I can't wait to have you in there to like go deeper on this stuff. Because I feel like it's not utilized enough. Like I know, and I will put my hand up to say I haven't really utilized it as much as I should have either, even though I know I should. But sometimes I think it's like, well, where do I start? So if you were to want to pitch to the media. Where do you start? Like, what's the first step? What do you need to prepare? I think that's probably the other thing I was thinking about this morning. Yeah, you can go and pitch. But if you haven't already prepared your business, or the outcome of what you want to achieve through that pitch. Like say you wanted to promote something particular that you want to sell through your business and you haven't necessarily built the backend of your business to support a spike in sales or something like that. Like, it's huge, right? Where do you start? That's a massive question.
20:08
And I need to come and do your masterclass to find out Yes, complete, you know, answer to that question. But you definitely need to have your business prepared for me your attention. Now the chance of you getting on the Today Show and selling out of your bath products, or whatever it might be is slim. But you definitely should have your media prepared, sorry, your business prepared for me your attention anyway. Because if you pitch to a journalist and your Instagram looks like, terrible, I can't swear cannot. That's all right. And you've taken all this time to pitch. So the first thing they'll do is go to your social media or your website. So you need to make sure that you're, you know, you're on brand on that social media, you don't need to be on social media 24/7, we just talked about this, before we hit record, you know, it is a beast, and you don't have to feed that beast 24/7. But you want it to be on if you're pitching in a certain tone or messaging or in a certain way, that should be reflected in your social media. And it should also be reflected on your website. So you know, links that work, contact, you know, contact details, the right imagery, all that stuff. And you should be doing that for your business. Anyway, regardless of where you're pitching to the media, your business needs to be prepared for any media attention. And it's easy to get your pitch accepted. If you have done the preparation work. With pitching the first the top tip I would give people without going into like layers of detail like we do in the master classes, start to be mindful of the media that you consume. And is that where your audiences like where is your market? Are they you know, 40 to 60 year old women who read the Australian women's weekly, you should be reading the Australian women's weekly. If that's the case, then you don't need to read it cover to cover you don't need to spend four hours researching every single media outlet. But you want to have like a top line view of who do they cover? What are their photoshoots look like? What's that there's normally a format in their profiles of the different women that they cover. And for regional women, you know, Australian, women's weekly, are really good at including regional and rural Australian women in their stories. So first of all, where is your audience? Do you know where they are in terms of media, and then you need to start to consume some of that media. And it's literally like, if you know that there's a certain podcast that a lot of your customers are likely to listen to, you should listen to a few episodes, only a few episodes, check around in the car, while you're taking the kids to school or whatever. And you start to go, Okay, I see this is a serious podcast, or it's a bit more fun, or it's a bit more casual, or it's more conversational. These are the they're normally looking for women with a challenging backstory, and you know, those sorts of things. So you're just looking to have start to think a bit more like a journalist without having to go to, you know, do a three or four year degree as a journalist. So yeah, being mindful of that media. Where's your audience? And you know, what kinds of stories and articles and you know, those sorts of things are being published in those places? Or with television shows and those sorts of things?
23:00
Yeah, I think too, because when we're consuming that kind of content, we're there for the story, right? We're there for that connection point. And it's different from an advertisement. We're not talking about advertisements. We're talking about story. Yeah,
23:15
I think in some rural speaking to your audience, summary will and regional publications, there will be you'll have to pay to play, we can talk about that in more detail in the class, but because they're small publications with beautiful photos and gorgeous stock and those sorts of things. So there are some exceptions to that rule. But generally, you know, it's organic media. So I think, you know, it's important to hear, be really mindful of what media you're pitching to, and understanding what they're looking for and being being mindful of, you know, just the top line news and current affairs of the day, what's trending, what are people talking about, you know, what's in the headlines, those sorts of things. Yeah.
23:58
And how you can leverage that to be like, Oh, I can add some value to whatever's going on. Yeah,
24:03
yeah, absolutely. And, and being able to move the story along. So, I mean, the, the Olympics will be the perfect example of that, right? Every everyone will be trying to pay back the popularity and the you know, it's it's one of those events where, you know, all eyes are turned to that event for two weeks, in the Matilda's were, you know, you know, went into that world cup semi final, everyone, you know, butchers were making green and gold sausages, and like, it was a whole everyone, which is good, but and there's lots of other ways you can get into the news, but just being mindful of like, you know, you know, what the top line kind of news and current affairs of the day that mean, you could probably I could tell you that off top my head now. Mental health, you know, women, women, you know, like women in leadership. You know, anything to do with AI, those sorts of things. You can just see a repeat pattern in lots of different kinds of media organizations. tackling this ame stories but with the lens of their media organization, on top of that,
25:04
yep. And I would imagine that it takes some crafting to be, as you said, I can't remember the exact words that you use, but to be able to go in at that level at that topic, and then shift it to there. Yeah, come back to your business.
25:22
Yeah, you need to have, you need to be able to draw a bow between your business, whatever that topic is, yeah, and it can't be too long ago. But once you started to, once you start to be more mindful of it, and you understand, like, what makes news and what kind of news stories or media we're looking for. Plus, in the back of your mind, you've consumed some of the media that you're thinking about pitching to, you'll be like, Ah, I can see what they're where they're going here with this story. You know, they're profiling a woman who's come from adversity, and who's, you know, done the work life juggle, and you know, she's talking about it in retrospect, because she's now this super successful businesswoman, or whatever the story might be. Once you start to see those news angles, they are repetitive. So you don't need to recreate the wheel, you just need to be able to infuse your brand into those stories, or move those stories along in some way. Yeah.
26:11
And that's some fantastic homework for anyone who's listening. Because you're nothing to do that, right? Just to get familiar with that, and then start to think outside the box, like how can I? How can I use that in my like, How can I tie the bow? What would be the bow for my business in that situation? And even just practicing that as an internal exercise for a while, I'm sure that would be really helpful to anyone who's listening to go, Oh, I
26:34
couldn't do that. Yeah, I can do that. I mean, most people are consuming the news anyway, the people are Mindlessly scrolling anyways. So if you're, you know, the other tip I would give, if anyone's like, going to do some homework before they come to your class, our class is, the beauty of social media is that you can curate your feed to serve up to you what you want to see. So if you want to follow Australian, women's weekly and see examples of those stories, you just have to like if you're their stories, and follow them, and it'll start to change your feed so that when you do have 10 minutes to yourself, or you're having a coffee in the morning, you can just scroll through that and go oh, yeah, I'd see that story I do. That's not a bad idea. I didn't realize those statistics that come out. You know, I you know, I'm a, you know, I'm, you know, I'm a fashion designer using only organic Australia wall. And I can see that wool prices have gone nuts because there's a trade ban on whatever that might be. But that's the way you can start to go, there's an opportunity, there's an opportunity, there's an opportunity, and you just drip feed that and you know, obviously building relationships with journalists as you go along. And that's kind of how you build your reputation as an industry expert. It's, it's you're playing the long game, when you're getting earned media, you'll definitely get a few quick wins easy, and it'll seem easy. But to stay in it and get repeatedly featured over time, does take some consistency. That's the same in any aspect of your business, you need to be consistent, it's boring advice. And I wish it wasn't true. But just being consistent, and literally taking an hour maybe on a Tuesday morning from nine to 10 to do a little bit of research, pitch a couple of stories. And then that's your media and PR done for the week. Yeah, making it bite sized and easy to do each week is a big tip, because no one needs another job to do in their small business. So don't make it you know, convoluted and hard work for yourself. Just you know, make it part of your day. If you consuming the news, just put your journalist cap on and start to look at it through the eyes of your business and how you can become infuse yourself into that story. And that's your research. Really.
28:32
Yeah, so good. Gosh, there's so much that I picked up already just from talking to you. Looking forward to the masterclass, but also people can reach out to you because you have an amazing course that you offer.
28:45
Tell us about that. Doors just closed actually, I know. I know. But that's okay. They go to my website is www dot Lise nabal.com. And just there's a on the homepage, you can click to add yourself to the waitlist for the next intake of the course which is in August. Yeah, media masters Academy is what it's called. And it's six weeks to teach you in depth basically, what some of what we've talked about today, plus you get to pitch for guest experts inside the course. So for this round of the course we have Shaun White, who's the consumer correspondent for sunrise, we have Lisa Brown, who is senior reporter with the current affair in 60 minutes, we have Eloise Keating, who's the news editor at smartcompany. And we have Amy McCarthy, who's the executive producer of daytime news at Channel Nine. So really cool experts you get to live pitch them. A lot of the time we get those stories featured with no guarantee but it's a really great way to meet journalists one on one and pitch to them inside the course. That's so cool. Yeah. Plus you get the theory of learning about the news cycle and where to hijack the news and yeah, but
29:53
to actually have the opportunity to experience like to actually pitch Yeah, real Time. That's so good to have you as the support person through that process. Yeah,
30:05
yeah. And it's really cool because all the guest experts are lovely. Like, it's obviously a non threatening environment. So people get nervous, but you don't need to be. It's all done online. And the and the guest experts, the journalists will just give really direct feedback. They'd be like, listen, that's not a news angle. But what about this part of your story? We're interested in that? Or what about you pitch that story to, you know, mamma mia or not, you know, Nine News or so they help like guide you in the right direction. They don't just go no, which is what would happen in a real life. And yeah, and email you didn't know, there were just not return to you not reply to your email. So you've kind of got this opportunity to forge a connection with them, get their advice, hopefully get featured, which we've had, you know, probably, we've probably got, like an 85% strike rate of getting, you know, students feature, which is awesome, but just getting it you know, you start to see, you know, and you can watch other people in the group pictures well, and then you start to go, oh, okay, I see where this is going. I see, you know, the daytime news is much more relaxed, and the nighttime news, and they're looking for more conversational, softer news stories, then, you know, murders, you know, fires. So like, you can start to get to know these basic facts that as journalists, we assume, knowledge of Yeah. And then you it's just a really great way to kind of expedite your knowledge and get you up to speed with pitching and you know, doing your DIY publicity for your own business. So
31:28
good. And like fine tuning in as you go with the support of the coaches, yourself. And also those journalists to get that instant feedback. And I think one of the best things that you can do is learn from others, like peers. That's why we also have the community inside of the membership as well, because there's so much knowledge that is within the collective group that can be shared, but also to observe someone pitching, it's so different, though, during the hot seat yourself. It's so different, because
31:58
it's so it's so true, because we're often like by week three people are getting pretty good at pitching. Yeah, one or two people in the course, is still spending, you know, six minutes before they've said what they do. And you can see other people going, you've got to get to the point, you've got to you've missed your hook. So learning from watching other people thinking, I'm, I need to stop talking and just get that pitch down to 10 seconds. Because you won't have six minutes normally to pitch to a journalist, you'll have 30 seconds. Yeah. So it is really powerful learning from other people in like a small group environment. And then you've obviously got me and you've got your guest expert as well. So So,
32:34
yeah, yeah, that sounds awesome. Thank you so much for being here today and sharing your time and your knowledge in story. I find your story so fascinating. And I've recently started doing Pilates Reformer classes, love them. Don't have bad classes here, unfortunately. But you know, I as a dancer, love blubber. So thank you so much for what you've shared here. And again, thank you so much for coming into the membership and presenting your masterclass, that's going to be so good. Good stuff. Alrighty. Well, thank you. Thank you for being here. And make sure you do reach out to Liz. If you have any questions or you want to explore what she offers. She is not only a powerhouse in this space, but you're also an awesome human so down to earth. And really grateful that I have you in my world to least say thanks.
33:32
Thank you, Donna.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
